Does God Exist ?, Yes, Says the Prince of Mathematicians !!! Options

[rom]

Visu, you've succeeded in sowing giant trees of self-doubt in Shivani's mind.

She reminds me of that little Russian girl...

Which? Lolita?

[Mandrake]

No rey rOm, the little girl who starts believing that she is the root cause of all the mishaps.
She goes to the toilet, and just as she pulls the flush, there's an earthquake and the building collapses around her.

She's crestfallen. "Oh my god what have I done? Maybe I shouldn't have pulled the flush chain..."

[shivani]

I know there is a message somewhere in that for me.
Would you please state in clear words? rather than beat around the bush?
Do you wish to say Ive illusioned myself in thinking that I really count ??
Or I'm illusioned that I can think ??

[Mandrake]

Shivani, if you haven't understood me yet, then you haven't understood me yet

I am trying to point out the exact opposite to what you are thinking. That you are a very intelligent person whose contributions to certain threads (at least ) are immensely appreciated.

It is time you stopped telling yourself that you are average and you are a spammer and keep walking away from each thread. Its good fun to have you around. Pls stay and contribute

Also, all the leg-pulling you are subject to is only because you are perceived as a good sport.

take heart. You are needed

[shivani]

sigh!
you had to explain MJ ?
couldnt you just kiss and make up !!
(mere acche khase EB ka satyanas kar dala)
PS : you think I reached post count of about 3K by walking out?

[visuja]

sigh!
PS : you think I reached post count of about 3K by walking out?

er... by walking out over and over and over and over....... and over again from many threads

Ok... before MJ s me .... lemme stop spamming and be a fly on this wall (too)

[shivani]

nah i dont walk out.. I stay put and hijack the threads
and since when did you join Priya and Gang?
Why is everyone so interested in turning into an insect suddenly

[NATURE]

( mom in law)

-->
---------------------
So you people are talking about God from philosophical point of view and
NOT from any Scientific Point of view ???
---------------------
Well, here are some lines for those who don't believe in God and also for those who believe in God ...
Great Minds said:

" God, in his(her) hand, has a book full of all the Mathematical formulae and theorems.
We need not believe in God, but we need to believe in that Book " --> Paul Arodo

" God can't create the Universe in the way he wants. Cause The Nature is created and governed
By Mathematical Rules and God can never scorn Mathematics " --> Albert Einstein

" Greatest Discovery of Human, is the Discovery of God.
We, the Human created god to witness in our happiness & grief " --> Subrahmanyam Chandrasekhar

" The probability of the existence of God is slightly less than 1/10000 " --> Lord Kelvin

" Faith is Blind, Feeling is the truth " --> Swami Vivekananda
------------------
So do NOT believe in God unless you feel God ----

[catch22]

You and I might not always be on the same page; but him (god) and me aren't even in the same library.
For the first time I am coming across someone who is ready to lay it across as proof of God's existence, Gauss' mathematical theory. Gauss, who was himself a devout christian should be turning in his grave at this turn of events. A mathematical probability is ok if it is the best you can get, but the evidence does not even begin to make God probable. If it is to be established that there is a God, then we have to have good grounds for believing that this is indeed so. Until and unless some such grounds are produced we have literally no reason at all for believing.

People accept many things as true" without evidence on good, reliable authority, assuming that a trustworthy source has good evidence - but ultimately they require evidence. Good evidence may be complicated - but scientists etc can understand it and are good authorities. Theologians from the various religions are not such good authorities - disagreeing with each other even within the same religion. This is nothing less than a religious assault on reason.

Personally, the concept of a God does not mean anything to me. It is only because of the impact on other people who believe in a God, that I think about it at all. I am a person who runs his life based on reason and logic. The concept of God is based on faith. I do not accept anything based on faith alone.

Is there a God? I really don't care. Even if there were one, it would not change my life one bit. Let us hypothetically accept for a moment that there is this creature called god. Could your mathematical theory tell us which god is this? Christian, Jew, Muslim, Hindu or what? Which is the true one? What shape or form it is?This all knowing omnipotent god creates, then brings about misery, disease, destruction, calamities, disasters on its own creation, not only on the good & the bad but even innocent children. Is it perverted to such an extent that it wrecks such havoc on its own creation.

The belief in God, heaven and hell is one of the ways our culture uses to coerce us into behaving properly. It is not logical that a perfect God would create flawed human beings and consign them to hell for behaving exactly as he designed them to, but we must eschew logic if we want to believe most religious tenets. If I believe in this god, I will dance with the angels in the so called after-life, if I don't then I will be an eternal barbecue. Do I care? not a rat's ass.

If you have an open mind, a truly open mind, spend your life examining and maintaining that openness. If you choose a religion, you will, ipso facto, close your open mind.If you really do have an open mind and are asking questions, then don't ask people who have never searched themselves, but have had their religion implanted in their minds as young children. It is truly a matter of choice, not discovery.

Religion, organized religion is a fabrication of mans fertile mind and the big lie. There is no rationality to religion any religion and all are based on myths and incredible falsehoods.

I think that the religionists have boxed themselves into a corner, depriving themselves of the joy of exploration of ideas. Those who feel compelled to make a god-or-not choice without exploring the myriad other possibilities are the real losers.

I do believe in argument as a method of inquiry, a way to arrive at the truth, and I believe that this is probably its most constructive role, but in an intellectual shell game argument is used to defend a fixed or preconceived idea against the truth.

Let me end this with a couple of quotes by George Carlin & Bertran Russell

"Religion easily has the greatest bullshit story ever told. Think about it, religion has actually convinced people that there's an INVISIBLE MAN...LIVING IN THE SKY...who watches every thing you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a list of ten special things that he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry for ever and ever ´til the end of time...but He loves you…..and He needs money!"
George Carlin (1937- )

"Religion is based, I think, primarily and mainly upon fear. It is partly the terror of the unknown and partly, as I have said, the wish to feel that you have a kind of elder brother who will stand by you in all your troubles and disputes. ... A good world needs knowledge, kindliness, and courage; it does not need a regretful hankering after the past or a fettering of the free intelligence by the words uttered long ago by ignorant men."

— Bertrand Russell,

[Mandrake]

Good post, Catch.
There are too many loose ends in the god-theory anyways. No known form, no known number, no known location, no definite way of connecting to him/her/it, no feedback, no response that is beyond reasonable doubt as coming from him...

Yes, far too many loose ends....

More points pls, Catch...

[rom]

You and I might not always be on the same page; but him (god) and me aren't even in the same library.
For the first time I am coming across someone who is ready to lay it across as proof of God's existence, Gauss' mathematical theory. Gauss, who was himself a devout christian should be turning in his grave at this turn of events. A mathematical probability is ok if it is the best you can get, but the evidence does not even begin to make God probable. If it is to be established that there is a God, then we have to have good grounds for believing that this is indeed so. Until and unless some such grounds are produced we have literally no reason at all for believing.

People accept many things as true" without evidence on good, reliable authority, assuming that a trustworthy source has good evidence - but ultimately they require evidence. Good evidence may be complicated - but scientists etc can understand it and are good authorities. Theologians from the various religions are not such good authorities - disagreeing with each other even within the same religion. This is nothing less than a religious assault on reason.

Personally, the concept of a God does not mean anything to me. It is only because of the impact on other people who believe in a God, that I think about it at all. I am a person who runs his life based on reason and logic. The concept of God is based on faith. I do not accept anything based on faith alone.

Is there a God? I really don't care. Even if there were one, it would not change my life one bit. Let us hypothetically accept for a moment that there is this creature called god. Could your mathematical theory tell us which god is this? Christian, Jew, Muslim, Hindu or what? Which is the true one? What shape or form it is?This all knowing omnipotent god creates, then brings about misery, disease, destruction, calamities, disasters on its own creation, not only on the good & the bad but even innocent children. Is it perverted to such an extent that it wrecks such havoc on its own creation.

The belief in God, heaven and hell is one of the ways our culture uses to coerce us into behaving properly. It is not logical that a perfect God would create flawed human beings and consign them to hell for behaving exactly as he designed them to, but we must eschew logic if we want to believe most religious tenets. If I believe in this god, I will dance with the angels in the so called after-life, if I don't then I will be an eternal barbecue. Do I care? not a rat's ass.

If you have an open mind, a truly open mind, spend your life examining and maintaining that openness. If you choose a religion, you will, ipso facto, close your open mind.If you really do have an open mind and are asking questions, then don't ask people who have never searched themselves, but have had their religion implanted in their minds as young children. It is truly a matter of choice, not discovery.

Religion, organized religion is a fabrication of mans fertile mind and the big lie. There is no rationality to religion any religion and all are based on myths and incredible falsehoods.

I think that the religionists have boxed themselves into a corner, depriving themselves of the joy of exploration of ideas. Those who feel compelled to make a god-or-not choice without exploring the myriad other possibilities are the real losers.

I do believe in argument as a method of inquiry, a way to arrive at the truth, and I believe that this is probably its most constructive role, but in an intellectual shell game argument is used to defend a fixed or preconceived idea against the truth.

Let me end this with a couple of quotes by George Carlin & Bertran Russell

"Religion easily has the greatest bullshit story ever told. Think about it, religion has actually convinced people that there's an INVISIBLE MAN...LIVING IN THE SKY...who watches every thing you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a list of ten special things that he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry for ever and ever ´til the end of time...but He loves you…..and He needs money!"
George Carlin (1937- )

"Religion is based, I think, primarily and mainly upon fear. It is partly the terror of the unknown and partly, as I have said, the wish to feel that you have a kind of elder brother who will stand by you in all your troubles and disputes. ... A good world needs knowledge, kindliness, and courage; it does not need a regretful hankering after the past or a fettering of the free intelligence by the words uttered long ago by ignorant men."

— Bertrand Russell,

Too good!
But I wish I were a believer...

[shivani]

But I wish I were a believer

In ??

[rom]

Something, someone...

[Nimii]

One shld be a believer in oneself!

N

[shivani]

But I wish I were a believer... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/doh.gif)

Something, someone...

Should I point out the obvious or you get it?